Michael Carrick

This topic contains 420 replies, has 37 voices, and was last updated by  jm1502 7 years, 3 months ago.

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  • #871036

    Scholsey
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    CM would you rather have a Scholes, Gerrard, Silva,Lampard above Carrick?

    The problem is Carrick doesn’t run around and get stuck in. There is a time to try and play nice tidy football and a time to dig in and fight hard to overcome the battle. It’s the rising up to the battle and taking ownership of the situation where Carrick fails miserably. When he fails there is no calming piano the only thing there is a man on his ar*e.

    Roy Keane, was he a piano or an electric guitar?

    #871054

    CM
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    Scholsey- Carrick and Scholes are different players to Gerrard, Silva, Lampard. You cannot exactly compare them, when 3 of them are attacking midfielders, whilst the others are play makers.

    Your 2nd paragraph is exactly what Neville means by English fans wanting an electric guitar. How many electric guitars do Barcelona have in midfield compared to Piano’s. Yaya Toure was a electric guitar and Barcelona got rid of him, yet in English football he is rightfully being praised. But that is the ethos of football here. Too many electric guitars and not enough piano’s and teh reason why we struggle to play football against top European sides.

    #871057

    Scholsey
    Participant
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    CM I really don’t think Matuidi is a piano but would love this guy in our team. I wouldn’t really say Motta is a piano but he ain’t too bad either.

    If your going to get a piano let it be the best and if your going to get a guitar let it be the best. Carrick isn’t and never was in the too tier of the piano or guitar section. Most of the pianos and electric guitars we have and not up to standard and that is our problem.

    #871063

    CM
    Participant
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    Scholsey- That is your preference and exactly the point Neville was making. English football fans prefer electric guitars to Piano’s whilst German, French, Spanish and Italian prefer Pianos’s. That is why our clubs struggle against them and always sit back. Like I said too many electric guitars and not enough piano’s.

    #871075

    Scholsey
    Participant
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    But my second paragraph is true. Do these pianos for Barca not work hard when they don’t have the ball. These pianos take ownership of the situation. Did our piano Carrick fails to take ownership against Sunderland? If Carrick did have this trait we wouldn’t have had this 15 page discussion.

    Was Keane a guitar or piano? Doesn’t really matter. He had leadership skills and a desire to get stuck in when needed and help others play as a supporting role in attcak if required. He had the desire to get forward and score crucial goals and put his body on the line. He was a winner who made it happen. You could be a piano and have the heart of a lion who makes things happen or a piano like Carrick who doesn’t

    #871078

    Scholsey
    Participant
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    I would like to know who Neville would prefer Carrick, Motta and Matuidi. But you posted Chelsea played counter because PSG had pianos. I’m just pointing out that it doesn’t matter what they are. It goes further than that.

    #871114
    hatters
    hatters
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    It’s quite funny reading this thread with all these piano/guitar references.

    #871147
    Zico
    Zico
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    CM-The reason why English teams have fallen behind is we are trying to play their game much because of we are having foreign managers. We cant cope with the top clubs technical games so we sit back and play them on the counter.
    However,not every foreign managers wants to play this way.
    There are exceptions like Marcelo Bielsa,Klopp,Yup Heyynkes who plays more direct football with wing play and not possession football like Guardiola and LVG which i think its bad for British football.

    I think its important we develop our own game,the British high octane game,with pressing a la 70s. Its our only chance to beat the technical sides.
    Its really in the DNA´s of Man United and to achieve this there are no room for Michael Carricks.

    Its more about getting the whole package player in one player like the Verattis,Gundogans,,Alabas and Clasies. There you have power,technique,pressing and a crisp passing game.

    I think its waste of space having central mids who are not capable of carry themselves or pressing opponents. I think its essential to have such players to develop our own game and to beat the top sides in Europe.

    #871183
    redblood
    redblood
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    CM-just for the sake of argument,Pirlo did not get humiliated in the lasts year CLs final.

    #871264

    CM
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    Scholsey- Motta is a deep/central lying playmaker, him, Verratti and Rabiot are PSG piano’s, whilst Matuidi is their electric guitar. That is 3 piano’s and 1 electric guitar midfielder. English teams have 3 workhorse and 1 passer. Reason why they are afraid to take top teams on. When United lose the ball, Carrick is one of the 1st to get it back with his interception skills, it is his tackling which is a problem.

    #871276

    CM
    Participant
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    Zico- You make some good points. But I am afraid the game has evolved now. Keano would have struggled against this Barcelona lot. I want English teams to at least take these top European sides on by playing football rather than sit back and hope to counter them. It is like a inferior boxer always in the corner with his gloves up looking to win with a lucky shot. It is embarrassing considering the amount of money is spent by top teams. The only way we move forward is by creating more passers rather bulldog type of player. The likes of Kante and Clasie would get destroyed by top European side’s.

    #871282

    CM
    Participant
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    Redblood- Pirlo’s average rating was 4 and 5 by most pundits. They said he could not grip the game and was out passed. Not sure what game you was watching.

    #871306

    fatrooney
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    Cm anfield last season is nearly a year ago in case you didnt notice what has he done since? In the final against spain italy were down to 10 men what happened in the first game in group stage i suppose you missed that didnt you. You’ve lost the plot mate to even compare carrick to pirlo shows your head is too far up carricks backside. What’s next cleverley is better than xavi? Only in your world. Like I said come back when carrick performs in a big game and don’t take another year to do so.

    #871321

    CM
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    FatRooney- Carrick missed the remainder of the season after the city game. You are looking at 7-8 games. He has also been injured some parts of this season as well. You seem to intentionally misplace facts don’t you.

    Plus about Pirlo, I am not making anything up. When Gattuso and Seedorf were on their last legs, he disappeared. Milan dropped him for Flamini for goodness sake. His form miraculously returned when he had better players around him. What does that tell you. Am I making this up? Care to counter it properly rather than ignore it and petty insults. No Cleverly is not better than Xavi.

    #871327

    CM
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    Also who got sent off in the euro 2012 final?

    #871339

    fatrooney
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    Keano might struggle against barca but against any other current midfield I’m sure he would do well. He certainly won’t struggle against catermole and tettey or even Michael carrick. Keane towards end of his time at united wasn’t consistent as before and everyone questioned whether he was finished. We need giys who are consistent good throughout the season carrick certainly isn’t consistent and needs to be moved on. Even pirlo has gone

    #871396

    CM
    Participant
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    Carrick was consistent between 2005-2013. Reckon some have been ungrateful towards what he has done for the club. Not saying he is Pirlo’s level, they are just similar players. I just do not get the argument that Carrick only performs well with good players, when even Pirlo could not perform when Gattuso and Seedorf were coming to an end.

    Look at our midfield against Barcelona back in 2011. Would Pirlo been able to control the game playing alongside a 37 year old Giggs, Valencia and Park. He has been quality with Vidal and Pogba, that is not a bad thing. People elude the fact he needs quality to be quality. When he does not have quality he is average and that was proven between 07-2011.

    #871453
    Zico
    Zico
    Participant
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    The game evolves and changes back as tides do by different managers philosophy.
    The most decorated manager and the top side to beat is Guardiola and Barcelona. Mourinho did it with Inter playing a 4-6-0,some would say he played a 4-3-3.

    Yup Heynkes displayed a wonderfull football with Bayern Munich and at the same time Klopp displayed the most entertaining football the world have seen in many years. Klopp humiliated Heynkes with a 5-2 win in one of the effective football and best games i have seen.

    Its about tactics and the right players to achieve it.
    And there is your contradictions regarding Carrick.
    You say ” I want English teams to at least take these top European sides on by playing football rather than sit back and hope to counter them”.
    Well,there you have Carrick in a nutshell,he thrives in sitting back dictating the play. He is very useless when the oppoents are close to him. It also means he is useless when it gets crowdy around him and thats what pressing opponents is all about.

    By the way you talk of your admiration of football you would be a lover of Marcelo Bielsa. He is the manager that wants to play the whole game in opponents half. I think you remember him he was the manager at Atletco Bilbao when we chrashed out against them in a 3-5 thumping.
    With the all the chances they created it scould have been a 3-11.
    He humiliated Fergie with his tactics in both legs.
    And yeah,your Carrick was deployed at the heart of of the central mid totally outplayed and vanished from the game.
    The truth? He couldnt handle the truth/pressing game,he was dizzy.

    #871513
    redblood
    redblood
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    CM-Outpassed yes,beaten yes[3-1],but humiliated no.I watched the only CL final that was last year,between Barca and Juve.

    #871522

    CM
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    Any midfielder would have struggled if they had a 38 year old and Cleveley alongside them and I believe one of the games, Carrick came on to play centre back.

    That is exactly my point Bilbao, out passing United. They would have done that to any team that day. Yet top English teams would have sat back and hit them on the counter.

    I used Neville electric guitar and piano quote earlier on in this thread. How are English teams going to improve or catch up if they are heavily reliant on electric guitar type of players.

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