Put faith in youth or spend billions?

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This topic contains 39 replies, has 11 voices, and was last updated by Wonderfuel Gas Wonderfuel Gas 11 hours, 53 minutes ago.

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  • #1556099

    happyhurling
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    Reading a lot recently about how much we’ve spent and how we should be a much better team because of that investment. Whilst i generally agree (Our impressive early season form aside) i think part of the problem is that we have had no real direction with our transfer dealings as Tommy alluded to in a recent post.
    Is that because we are torn between sticking to our traditions and trying to keep up with the spending of the City’s, Chelsea’s and PSG’s of this world? As a club the echos of the Busby Babes reverberate around the stadium, play youth and always attack. But the youth hasn’t been delivering for a long time now and i think it’s impaired our ability to be objective in the transfer market. Even though we buy big, we still try to invest in youth.
    Martial, Bailly, Pogba, Lukaku, Depay, Shaw, sticking with Lingard and promoting Rashford, Tuanzebe and MacTominay from the reserves all point to a strategy that says “invest in young players”. And we have that very proud achievement of always having a youth product in the match day squad. Whilst i think this is a good strategy it also means we struggle to have a clear idea of how to invest in experienced players.
    With each exciting prospect, Martial or Rashford, we’ve bought a Bastian Schweinsteiger or a Daley Blind to try to nurture these young players through. But where we’ve failed is in not buying the right experienced player. Maybe we spent all our money on the youth and therefore had to penny pinch on the experienced players? Or maybe we didn’t think the experienced players were as important as the young players and misaligned our focus. Either way it hasn’t worked because we’ve not managed to get the best out of the young players and the experienced players have all started to be shipped out. Almost ruining the careers of Shaw, Depay, Januzaj & Schneiderlin etc whilst having to ship out the likes of Schweinsteiger, Rooney, Valdes and Fletcher which has also left an awkward gap of players with question marks over them who fall into neither category like Smalling, Fellaini, Mkytaryian, Young, Lindelof and Mata.

    Bit of a long post but, essentially, i think we need to redefine our transfer strategy. We’ve got the basis of a very good and young team why don’t we now try to compliment that with some of the best, experienced players in the world. The way City have done with Silva, De Bruyne, Aguero etc. I don’t hold out any hope for transfers in January but i do expect us to be going big for the best, most experienced players in the world next summer. Let’s maybe take one eye off these young players and bring in some players who can actually deliver consistent performances on a weekly basis. Cheers.

    #1556150
    killyboye
    killyboye
    Participant
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    I think we are trying to penny pinch by investing in youth and not buying experienced players. The club seems to want to move to a situation where all our players come from the academy and we have only limited investment in the first team. I suppose this would be the ideal aim of every team but for us it seems to be a money saving issue, not a philosophy issue.

    #1556196

    Personally I think we need to spend our money on the best young players who will stick around for years to come.

    City did really well in investing in Gabriel Jesus, Sane, Stones and Sterling – the first two were always gonna be great players and the latter two seemed like they’d be great players too. This year all four are on top form which means City now have 4 top class players for the next 10 years.

    We’ve done well investing in Martial, Pogba and Lukaku however we need to go after the 18, 19 and 20 year olds from “smaller” clubs and give them the platform to take the next step up and give them game time and have some faith in them.

    We need to invest in players like Pulisic, Soler, Meyer, Lemar, Werner, Asensio, Henrichs, Jorge, Tierney… the list is endless of good young players who can be top class who we can attract from “smaller” clubs. Sure, some of them will have injury issues (like Shaw) and others will not live up to standard (Smalling) however overall we’ll still have good squad players in the long run.

    #1556198
    MacGuffin
    MacGuffin
    Participant
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    I agree with Sympathy and have said it often enough. BUT we must move on quickly those who do not look like they will make the grade. If we keep them hoping one day they do and then add them to ever increasing number of “decent squad player” then we find ourselves in the situation we have been.

    #1556217

    happyhurling
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    I think something might be about to implode at United with Jose and the board. If we have another few bad results and get further away from city/overtaken by spurs and Chelsea it could go bad real quick. If he leaves are we in the same situation we were when he arrived? A squad of players who the new manager must choose which ones he likes and which ones have to go. It really could get into a vicious circle of chopping and changing managers and players for years.

    #1556221
    MacGuffin
    MacGuffin
    Participant
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    Jeeeeeeez happy – the booze must have worn off. Its weekend time to top up isn’t it.

    Personally, I have the feeling there’s something in the rumours of JM not happy with Ed and club spending as well as the PSG link. I would not be surprised if JM leaves “by mutual consent”.

    And yes, we will be scuppered. A new manager comes in a decides Matic, Lukaku etc are not his cup of tea.

    My preference (said it before) is not going to happen but still my dream … is an old boy we all like and trust who has United at heart. He will make many screw ups and needs to grow into the job but with SAF and good staff he can be made into a good manager just as we can make players.

    #1556228

    happyhurling
    Participant
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    You’re right Mac – it really is depressing being a miserable cunt! I best get down the boozer!! 😂😜

    #1556285

    libanski
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    Mourinho should stay at least 2 more years, as a manager he’s the only one who has got the balls to make the big decisions and not flinch, tactically he may not be your cup of tea esp against the big sides but if it were up to me i’d give him a bumper pay rise promise to let him go if he wishes after the two years and if he builds a team which can challenge both in the league and the champions league he’ll take his bonus with him wherever he wants to go and still drive him there. Ultimately it’s all in his hands he can choose to give up and leave us in a mess or man up and build that team and make himself a name

    #1556410

    happyhurling
    Participant
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    Libanski – Maybe we just need to stop being proud and spend £50m on each position in the team like City have done. Keep De Gea, Bailly, Pogba, Matic, Martial, Rashford and Lukaku. Then spend an absolute fortune on all the other positions, enough that guarantees success. That’s what City are doing. We can’t match them by promoting Scott MacTominay!

    #1556500

    Scholsey
    Participant
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    http://www.transferleague.co.uk/tottenham-hotspur/english-football-teams/tottenham-hotspur-transfers

    Happy you don’t have to spend it on every player/position. Look at Tottenham’s spending and we have greater pulling power than them.

    #1556552
    redblood
    redblood
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    Both,keep singing 1 or 2 players like Pogba and Lukaky every summer,and give youngsters a chance instead of signing mediocre/average players like Blind,Rojo,Fellaini,Herrera,Mata,Valencia,plus keeping the likes of Carrick,Young,Jones,Smalling, for too long @ the club.

    #1556580

    happyhurling
    Participant
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    Scholesy – Yeah Spurs are a good blueprint, they’re everyone’s favourite team at the moment aren’t they? But they’ve won fuck all and I don’t think they ever will. I still think they’ve got Harry Kane and Dele Ali and after that they’ve got a squad of very good second tier players. Actually you’d probably add Eriksson (if you can get him out of Shane Duffy’s pocket from last night!!) and Alderweireld. Wanyama, Dier, Son, Winks, Trippier etc are all second tier players. But Pinocchio has them working very well as a team and fair play to them. I don’t think we should be following in their footsteps though.

    #1556581

    Scholsey
    Participant
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    Happy there is no point trying to start a convo with you it’s a waste of time. Everything everyone else does is shite but what we do is great.

    Keep promoting Herrera, Valencia, Young and co mate.

    #1556598

    Blacky
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    @Happy – If most of Spurs’s squad are strictly “second tier players” then most people would suggest that an even bigger majority of ours are 4th or even 5th rate mate.Take your bleeding blinkers off for once please!.
    Based on the last 2 or 3 seasons performances overall how many out of our first 11 would get into theirs do you think?.On second thoughts I’m sorry I asked now because you’ll probably include Valencia,Jones,Herrera and grandpa Mata in the list!!.

    #1556610

    homerjay540
    Participant
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    It’s easier for players who join mid table teams. Less in the public eye, less competition for places, less media scrutiny – after making a mistake they can get on with things.
    For this reason I’m with @redblood – sign a couple really really quality first team players every season, fill the squad places with hungry, up and coming squad players and if a signing doesn’t work out, sell on after two years (or loan first to put him in shop window/increase his transfer value)
    I think in the past we have been hesitant to sell on players who haven’t made enough impact after a couple seasons out of fear the player will end up fulfilling their potential at a rival club. Ways to reduce the likelyhood of this happening: Buy back clauses and sell on percentages

    #1556632
    redblood
    redblood
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    Blacky-Both Aldwereild and Vertonghen would walk into our team,in fact I believe them 2 to be the best CD in the league.I would take Eriksen over Mata and Miki any day of the week,and obviously right now Kane is the best striker in the league,so him over Lukaku.Both Alli and Martial are way too inconsistent and too young,so cannot decide!.Wanyama over Herrera,but Matic over Eric “Kieron” Dier.

    #1556644

    Blacky
    Participant
    • :

    @redblood – I think the only players we have that you could argue would stand a chance of getting in a combined eleven (not squad players) would be DDG,Pogba,Matic and either one of Martial or Rashford.
    Erikson is one of the best attacking midfielders around so he would walk it as would both their full backs and as you say Vertonghen and Alderwerield are the best partnership in the EPL,so they are nailed on as well.Then you have Kane and Dele Alli.
    It’s funny how this group of “second tier” players managed to finish a mere 17 points above us last season eh mate?!!.

    #1556645
    redblood
    redblood
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    Fuck me @blacky,did we really finish 17 points behind Spurs?!

    #1556649
    redblood
    redblood
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    Asensio is one of the best young players out there and Real have a release-clause of £300m!
    I would have thought only City have spent more than us recently!

    #1556668

    Blacky
    Participant
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    Afraid so mate,and the small matter of us being ‘just’ the 35 behind them on goal difference as well!.

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