Fulham Away Sat Aug 6th KO 12.30pm

This topic contains 208 replies, has 18 voices, and was last updated by MrMakaveli MrMakaveli 1 month, 2 weeks ago.

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  • #2121642
    MrMakaveli
    MrMakaveli
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    • :

    If Bellingham is a future world class player for us for the next decade or so, no way I would. If our only choice was to not get any this window then I wouldn’t.

    Barca are basically trying to cancel Due Jong’s contract thought or close. He’ll have 2 years left and be owed 20m, also be really pissed off that they’ve gone back on an agreed contract.

    We’d probably get him for 30m. Could we not swing that and then Bellingham next summer?

    #2121656

    kopite
    Participant
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    We have 3 midfielders whose contract end next summer as things remain so I’d rather have 2 quality midfielders ahead of one possible world class player.

    #2121661

    nine nine nine
    Moderator
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    Mak, “Manchester United have agreed to pay Barcelona a guaranteed fee of €75million (£63million, $75million) for Frenkie de Jong, The Athletic understands.

    It is understood United could also pay add-ons worth €10million (£8.47million, $10million).”

    Given the above you’re being more than a tad optimistic in declaring that De Jong will be available for £30m and anyway hasn’t Klopp said he won’t go into the transfer market again this Summer without there’s a long term injury?

    #2121677

    gingerlfc
    Participant
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    “He’s a young player and has a lot of good qualities but doesn’t have the defensive instincts required to play in our midfield. He’s been here long enough.”

    This teenager has just turned 19 in recent months.
    Has yet to play a full season in a red shirt.

    Your expectations of midfielders playing in the Prem, in one of the best teams in world football, are simply ridiculous.

    #2121679
    Rob Fort Worth TX
    Rob Fort Worth TX
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    Nine, I would imagine FDJ would want to play CL footy so I honestly can’t see that Utd deal happening. The fee you mentioned tho seems more realistic than the 30 bargain basement Mak said plus Barca are a whopping billion smackers in debt so they’re not in the Bargain Hunt mood atm.

    #2121691
    Razor
    Razor
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    The latest word from Melissa Reddy is the same old schtick that we’ll only get a midfielder if the right one becomes available. I.e. they already know who they want. Given that the only midfielder that we’ve been seriously linked with is Bellingham, I doubt that the long term plan is to actually buy 2 more midfielders. Let’s face it, Ox contributes virtually nothing and even when push comes to shove, he won’t make the bench. If we know that, those at the club will also be aware of that. I doubt he’s part of any serious considerations when it comes to squad building. A non-factor if you will. Keita is still reportedly in talks over a new contract so that looks like what we’re trying to do. That only leaves Milner and Bellingham would be a more than adequate replacement. Morton is also rated highly so they’ll have another look at him if he has a good season on loan. I imagine that they would also want another forward once Firmino goes. Academy and game changers as Ljinders put it.

    #2121702

    Sean the sailor
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    De Jong will go to Chelsea by the looks of it. Not sure they need him as kante and kovacic are sone pairing and jorghino is not to bad either.

    We won’t be signing anyone. Totally agree ginger. Writing off Elliot after a bad injury and only 19 yet let’s play bajetvic . Sorry razor mate, I don’t get that

    Also taa is only 23. Huge expierence and oriole want him dropped

    Hate to see the views on here if we actually lose 😂

    #2121707
    Razor
    Razor
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    Elliott came back from his injury in the middle of last season. He’s had pretty much half a year. He’s not walking off the treatment table and into training here. If he’s still that positionally lost after 1/2 a year back in training, there’s something wrong with the way he’s been going about his business. It’s an issue that saw him dropped after being given the chance in some really high profile games. Thiago does an insane amount of defensive work on top of all the other stuff which Elliott definitely can’t offer. With Henderson already defensively suspect, Klopp will be wary of this. I didn’t say he wouldn’t make it. I just wouldn’t start him in this current situation. As a defensive minded midfielder with great composure and technique on the ball, Bajcetic is the best fit among those 3 options. Again, this is not a knee-jerk reaction to anything. Seen some reports that Keita might be back for the next game anyway. Automatic starter in our current situation if that’s the case.

    As for Trent, I can understand the attitude towards him given how most pin the CL final defeat on him for a similar error. I still wouldn’t play Milner or Gomez ahead of him in any circumstance.

    #2121740

    gingerlfc
    Participant
    • :

    “Thiago does an insane amount of defensive work on top of all the other stuff which Elliott definitely can’t offer”

    I wonder what could be the difference between recently turned 19yr old Elliot and recently turned 31yr old multi league, cup and CL winning Thiago.

    #2121777
    MrMakaveli
    MrMakaveli
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    Nine, the fee that Utd agreed with Barca was before they declared his latest contract to be void due to criminal activity, with a threat to invoke criminal proceedings, so it’s completely irrelevant.

    My 30m was still a guess but regardless, there are reasons as to why De Jong refused to move, and it’s not just because he would want to play CL football, even if that would also be a big factor but from that large fee that Utd were willing to pay, Barca would have to give De Jong 20m of it in back wages, which they have refused, hence their most recent (honestly insane) actions

    So, as things stand, Barca might not even get 30m. They have basically told the player that he can get stuffed, with regards to an insane amount of back salary owed, ripping 4 or so years off the contract between them…. He might just go for nothing in 2 years, so I don’t think 30 is at all exaggerated, especially with the also very recent news that La Liga have rejected their reckless selling of TV rights and assets, being not enough, in order to register the players that they have bought so far.

    Basically Barca have to stump up another 150m, 100m or so of which they will get by selling another 25% of their production company (which they never intended) and the rest, from player sales…. But they are running out of time and clubs will be looking to exploit their stupidity.

    So, I could totally be wrong here and Barca may look after de Jong in a large transfer but it’s certainly not looking that way.

    I seriously think there is a good chance that Barca won’t exist in a few years btw.

    #2121778
    MrMakaveli
    MrMakaveli
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    Rob, in La Liga a club can buy all the players they want but if they fail to meet La Ligas financial rules, those players can’t be registered to play in the league.

    Barca are in massive debt and their strategy for getting out of this, has been to spend insane amounts of money whilst selling their future La Liga TV rights and some of the above referenced production company. This money was used to clear some of the debt, so they could register said players but it’s been rejected by La Liga on the grounds that some of the debt was cleared in an … Interesting manner. They’ve been told that they need to clear more debt, so frankly it won’t matter what kind of mood they are in. They will be in firesale mode of they make a single other mistake, or none of their new signings can play for them, and they also won’t be able to buy Bernardo Silva, who is clever enough wait until they can register him, before moving.

    On a side note, the deal to buy Raphinha, is basically a delayed payment situation where I think on the La Liga deadline or close, if Barca fail to make said payment, they get a very very severe financial penalty. I think it’s around 12 million, to Leeds.

    The only reason the deal went through like this is down to him forcing a move. I bet you he’s sweating his balls off now tho lol.

    #2121788

    nine nine nine
    Moderator
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    Mak, I don’t think De Jong wants to leave Barca but if he does I’m pretty sure it will be for a lot more than £30m. Chelsea for instance have allegedly just bid the same as United for De Jong.

    Barca are in a complete mess and shouldn’t be allowed to trade as they are, the contract situation is a red herring imo the previous Board and President were acting on behalf of Barcelona when they offered the new contract to De Jong.

    According to The Athletic’s David Ornstein, Barcelona has told de Jong that the terms of his current contract may involve criminality and may have grounds for legal action. “May” is the operative word here and I suspect would be very hard to prove even if there is any substance to the claim.

    Putting all of the above aside though Klopp is on record as saying he won’t make any more signings in this window without there is a long term injury. So whether De Jong leaves Barca in this window and at whatever the price it’s very unlikely that Liverpool will be looking to sign him and they are seemingly keeping their powder dry for a big bid for Bellingham next Summer.

    #2121789

    pinezes69
    Participant
    • :

    Bajetic is the future but now we need experienced players below 30ies if we want to win something…

    #2121841

    Songman
    Participant
    • :

    I’ve only just calmed down after we drew a game that we were strong favourites to win, but for me, Klopp has to take the blame for this result, why on earth did he not start Núñez? Why pay £85M for one of the best strikers, only to keep him on the bench? Of course this alone may not have won the match, because most of the team had a poor attitude, but Núñez was 10 times as effective as the anonymous, mediocre Firmino, so most likely we would have won if he started. Look at the chaos he caused when her came on.

    So Haalnd is ready to start in the league, but Núñez is not? This claim that Núñez needs time to adapt to the way we play is total, utter rubbish, and he has to start every big game for us now, starting on Monday.

    #2121847

    Songman
    Participant
    • :

    Correction… “when he came on.”

    #2121850

    Songman
    Participant
    • :

    If we don’t sign a midfielder in this window, we have to find a way to cope with what we have, and it’s a dangerous, risky scenario, considering how injury prone, and inconsistent our midfielders are – definitely our weakest department. One option to mitigate this could be to play the ball long a bit more, and target Núñez, thus lessening the pressure on the midfield.

    Fabinho and Henderson are regular starters, with Keïta and Elliott competing for the third spot. I don’t want to sound negative, but the rest, namely Jones, Ox, Milner and Bajcetic don’t have the quality, are too frequently injured, or are too young to challenge for the league, they’re just squad players.

    Still some time left in the transfer window, so anything could happen, but if not, we soldier on.

    #2122039
    MrMakaveli
    MrMakaveli
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    • :

    Nine, if Chelsea are mad enough to bid the same as United, nearly a 3rd of it will be going directly to De Jong.

    Again, I was guessing with that figure but my rationale for it is written above. i can understand why utd would pay crazy money in the circumstances that Barca find themselves in, because they are equally as desperate ( although not reckless) as Barca…. But Chelsea?… Pure stupidity.

    He might be a great player for him but they should wait and snatch him when Barca get into full panic mode.

    #2122044
    MrMakaveli
    MrMakaveli
    Participant
    • :

    Songman, I agree with most of that. I dunno, I’m trying to be positive and remember that it’s just one game but then there’s a huge part of me that wants to scream that EVERY SINGLE MATCH IS VITAL.

    It isn’t just Firmino, although he was truly awful. Thiago was rubbish before he got injured and don’t even mention the other 2.

    But as for the creativity, we don’t need longballs. We have Robbo, Trent, Diaz and Salah all supplying the agent of chaos.

    It’s this that gives me confidence, even if half the team fucking threw the game. Van Dijk was shit too. He doesn’t get away from this.
    I bet you that Klopp went fucking nuts at them at full-time. He rarely comments on what he says to the players but he hinted that some things had to be said.

    I get what you’re saying about not starting Nunez but I’ll give him the benefit of the lesson. If he doesn’t start Nunez against palace tho….

    #2122091

    nine nine nine
    Moderator
    • :

    Mak, that’s the price for De Jong and he’s a top top player and still only 25.I think he would prefer to stay in Catalunya as both he and his fiancee enjoy the lifestyle there but Barca do need to raise some money to get their new signings registered so he still could go. Time will tell?

    #2122153
    MrMakaveli
    MrMakaveli
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    • :

    I’m not doubting his quality but the length of a players contract and their likelihood to sign a new one are massive factors on their price. Granted he’d still have 2 years left if they managed to push through their claims but I think if they ripped him off of 20m, he’d not sign an extension, regardless of being happy there, which BTW is likely just because he’s refusing to leave before he gets paid what he’s owed.
    Under the circumstances, I think most of us would be “settled” in Barcelona! (Not that we wouldn’t either way…)

    Out of all of this, Barca are an excellent care study. They might turn out to be a great example of how to or how not to do things. My guess is they are far likelier to be a causionary take but you never know.

    As for whatever Chelsea agree, i bet you it’s lower than what it’s bid.

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