Peoples vote looking more and more likely

This topic contains 643 replies, has 17 voices, and was last updated by  Laughing Lenny 3 weeks, 2 days ago.

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  • #1722769
    MacGuffin
    MacGuffin
    Participant
    • :

    what a pity those who follow politics do not behave as they would when following football. I can imagine May meeting the EU leaders in Brussels with the Brexit fans gathered in the plaza outside swilling beer and singing German bombers. That would put some psychological pressure on those Brussel Sprouts.

    #1723648
    MacGuffin
    MacGuffin
    Participant
    • :

    Leavers talked about chaos at the border with long waits for customs checking trucks. The government announces that there will be no check. All the company has to do is file a short form online 2 hours before at the latest and the trucks are waved through. Easy peasy. This talk of chaos is scaremongering. When you think about it, customs could easily have an inspector on board ferries and/or at the departure port.

    Most if not all of the practicalities of borders are easily solved with technology, paper trails, good systems and common sense.

    #1723680
    Alfie07
    Alfie07
    Participant
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    I think there is an issue with customs at the departure port and onboard ferries as I believe, and I maybe wrong here, but custom checks need (by law) to be carried out in the country of arrival. So they could, in theory, be done on the ferry, but only in UK waters which isn’t that far out.

    #1723696
    MacGuffin
    MacGuffin
    Participant
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    Between Parliament, bilateral ageements and ships captains anything can be done, but no matter. When the UK customs officers asks the truck driver on the ferry if he objects to them checking his load, he can say No but then he knows what will await him on arrival at the port.

    Didn’t UK immigration conduct checks in Calais to prevent the jungle people ?

    #1726848
    MacGuffin
    MacGuffin
    Participant
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    We are in a muddle aren’t we. I assume this post is for the schoolgirl topic and not the Brexit one. But hey, who cares about details right.

    #1728375
    D1rtyH4rry
    D1rtyH4rry
    Participant
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    Why is it only satirical outlets, that have their finger on the pulse? Probably because we are being taken the piss out of I suppose.

    #1728385
    AshCFC
    AshCFC
    Participant
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    That’s the most worthwhile contribution to this thread in quite a while DH

    #1728413
    D1rtyH4rry
    D1rtyH4rry
    Participant
    • :

    Cheers Ash. I have to find the humour. Or else i’d be curled up into a ball.

    #1728448
    AshCFC
    AshCFC
    Participant
    • :

    Haha DH. Ain’t that the truth.

    #1731180
    MacGuffin
    MacGuffin
    Participant
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    Fergie coined a term that has become a standard phrase in football……. squeaky bum time.

    I was just thinking how apt the phrase is for Brexit for some.

    But for me, I think I would prefer another term …….. let one go.

    I’ll let you guys work that one out.

    #1735104
    MacGuffin
    MacGuffin
    Participant
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    Jeez the more I read about Brexit the less I understand, or better said, the less there is to understand. Just reading about the May agreement …

    under the draft agreement, the UK will stay inside the bloc’s single market and remain subject to EU laws and regulations until the end of December 2020 while the two sides attempt to iron out a new trade relationship.

    That’s not a transition period. A transition is changing from A to B but you cannot transition if you don’t know what the change will be.

    That is an delay in leaving because still “remain subject to the EU laws” and is no different from an extension. Its not a deal. Its an agreement to try to negotiate an agreement.

    And there’s double-speak everywhere. Remaining in a “customs union” means not being able to negotiate our own trade deals and set our own regulations & tariffs. That in effect means not leaving the EU.

    Then elsewhere I read about how no deal Brexit will mean higher food prices. How is that then. If we are free to decide our own import tariffs we can decide not to charge anything on Spanish tomatoes.

    Likewise with border controls, we can decide whether to have a control at the border or not. If border crossing present no problems why would we have a control. And if they do (eg illegals, smuggling etc.) then what’s the argument for us not being allowed to prevent crime.

    It’s all waffle and twaddle by politicians making a big deal out of a potential no deal.

    PS – And as for the People’s Vote, Labour have been banging the drum about the need for a second referendum then when it is put before Parliament don’t vote for it.

    #1735399
    AshCFC
    AshCFC
    Participant
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    As someone (panel) said on QT last night, you’re either in or you’re out. If you leave with a deal you’re not really out.

    #1735416
    MacGuffin
    MacGuffin
    Participant
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    If its a deal that cedes any authority then yes that’s true. A deal in terms of scratching each others backs, you charge us this for this and we charge you that for that, is a normal business agreement.

    #1735470
    AshCFC
    AshCFC
    Participant
    • :

    ‘A deal in terms of scratching each others backs, you charge us this for this and we charge you that for that, is a normal business agreement.’

    I think you’d call that a trade deal. Not a Brexit deal.

    #1735486
    MacGuffin
    MacGuffin
    Participant
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    Erm… yes true but much of Brexit is trade related. Most other issues like divorce bill, citizens rights have been sorted.

    And the whole purpose of going into or staying in Europe is trade. The problem is that the EU changed that by trying to make EU a political and social union.

    #1735566

    nine nine nine
    Moderator
    • :

    Impossible to predict what will happen next.

    Seemingly at least we won’t be leaving without a deal.

    MV 3 might even go through next week as Brexiters in Parliament being to realise it’s the only deal on offer that takes us out of the EU especially as allegedly the EU are only looking to offer us a circa two year extension rather than an extension to June 30th.

    The world is looking at us and laughing and no one in Parliament is innocent in all of this mess.

    #1735590
    MacGuffin
    MacGuffin
    Participant
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    Does the deal take us out of the customs union and let us negotiate trade deals with other nations? If it doesn’t then we’re not really out are we.

    #1735598

    nine nine nine
    Moderator
    • :

    Mac, May’s deal takes the UK out of the Custom Union and allows us to do our own trade deals.

    #1735958
    MacGuffin
    MacGuffin
    Participant
    • :

    999 – Are you sure? What is the source of your information? As I understand it, the agreement gives until the end of 2020 for the UK-EU to agree on a trade deal. And until then UK would have to abide by all EU laws but would give up its place on the institutions making those laws ie

    – keep the EU regulations that were the reason for many wanting to leave
    – have the same tariffs on goods imported into UK as EU tariffs
    – remain in a “single customs terriitory” ie customs union
    – The UK will remain under European Court of Justice (ECJ) jurisdiction during the transition.

    The single customs territory is basically another name for a temporary customs union and, if it were needed, it would ensure that completely frictionless trade could continue across the Irish border. But it would also prevent the UK implementing any trade deals with other countries around the world that involve removing tariffs on goods.

    https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-46237012

    So as I said before, the agreement is no more than an extension since it keeps us bound to the restrictions of the EU and gives none of the freedoms we have by being out of it. It is a sham.

    PS – This is why the USA said that the May deal would in effect kill a US-UK deal. This is what annoys me, the People moan about not having full information when they voted Leave but they don’t have full information now because they do not know what other deals can be made with other countries.

    #1735959
    MacGuffin
    MacGuffin
    Participant
    • :

    This i a better summary ……

    Britain will formally exit the EU on Friday, March 29, 2019, at which point it will cease to be involved at any level in EU decision-making.

    However, under the draft agreement, the UK will stay inside the bloc’s single market and remain subject to EU laws and regulations until the end of December 2020 while the two sides attempt to iron out a new trade relationship.

    During this period, all existing EU “regulatory, budgetary, supervisory, judiciary and enforcement instruments and structures” will continue to apply within the UK, including rulings made in the Court of Justice of the EU.

    In effect, the transition period provides the two parties with additional time in which to continue negotiations. If the extra 21 months prove insufficient — and critics suggest they almost certainly will — the transition period can be extended, by joint agreement before July 1, 2020, for an unspecified period of time.

    And as regards immigration ……….

    Freedom of movement will be maintained until a final agreement is reached, and EU citizens and UK nationals arriving in the host state during the transition period will enjoy the same rights as those who arrived in the host state before March 30, 2019.

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