Phillipe Coutinho Correia

This topic contains 21 replies, has 11 voices, and was last updated by Razor Razor 1 month, 1 week ago.

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  • #1825748
    Rob Fort Worth TX
    Rob Fort Worth TX
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    • :

    It seems this situation won’t go away and I’m not bloody helping it am I? Lol.

    I liked Phil, fantastic player and was sad to see him leave but obviously glad with what we did with some of his transfer money and believe that if that transfer to Barca had not happened then maybe Virgil and Alisson may not have arrived and consequently not won what we won last May and currently hold a 22 point lead at the top of the league in mid Feb.

    But, would like to consider the pros and cons if we did buy him back:

    Pros

    Another top player to our squad especially if we lose other mids in the summer (Lallana, Shaqiri)?

    Another attacking option and a bloody good one. Even with our success this season we’ve seen games that could have gone either way or drawn and a plan B (not saying Phil would be that as a 70 million or whatever is a very expensive plan B) but his skillset and the fact that he is completely different to any mid we have could have finished games off completely.

    Cons

    Could the potential purchase price be used elsewhere to better balance what we have? Back up left back, lower cost mid, a centre forward, a back up keeper if Adrian leaves?

    Would it upset the chemistry and balance we have now within the squad in other words if it ain’t broke…..?

    Would it halt the development and progress of Curtis Jones?

    Does a returning player ever continue where he left off. Historically for us it’s been very indifferent.

    Your thoughts but before you do please look at it from both sides and try and give an argument for a yea or nay not just ‘he can buggar off, he made his bed etc.’

    Me, personally, if the price is right, I’d re-sign him but only if that price is right. Only.

    #1825753
    Razor
    Razor
    Participant
    • :

    A few things. This is not going to happen while Klopp is here. The way he left is why we wouldn’t have him back. Klopp won’t have players who want out when the going’s tough and then want back in when things don’t go their way elsewhere. He’s all smiles on the surface but behind the scenes he’s already shown how ruthless he can be.

    The next is his price tag. He’s 28 in the summer and would cost around 70mil if reports are to be believed. Why would we pay that money for Coutinho and his wages which would rank at the top of the club when we could make moves for younger players who wouldn’t cost as much? They would have space and time to develop in an established team and may be able to perform at that level in 1 or 2 seasons. A player like this would arguably be a better fit for us and I’d argue that we already have such a player with a fit Keita who’s better suited for our style of play. If he’s not signed for the midfield and instead for the front 3, then banking on someone like Sancho with a seemingly unlimited ceiling, would make far more sense for big money.

    From a playing perspective we’ve changed the way we play since that time. If we do get him, he would need to do both sides of the game well and that includes an extremely detailed and unique pressing system that players outside the club won’t have experienced before and I seriously doubt that he can. Also when he left, the word is that Klopp had the final say and decided to let him go because we were too predictable going forward with him in the team. We either run the risk of reverting back to this or he’d be coming back into an entirely different system that wouldn’t accommodate him anymore which leads me to my next point.

    I’ve said elsewhere that the club has a philosophy where we can make plan A better instead of having a plan B when plan A goes wrong. Signing a player like Coutinho would undoubtedly be a plan B signing and that’s just not how we work these days.

    #1825773

    Mikus
    Participant
    • :

    In his last two seasons for us, Coutinho scored 14 in 36 appearances, and 12 in 20 appearances. On average, a goal every 2 games.

    Since leaving, he’s scored 10 in 22, 11 in 54, and currently at Bayern he’s scored 7 in 27. On average, a goal every 4 games. He may not have been very settled since he left us, but how likely is it that he could repeat the stats and form he showed for us before he left? All depends where his head is at. Admittedly, it’s tempting to think Klopp is charismatic enough to get him back to his best. But my feeling is that Coutinho has probably mentally drifted too far and lost confidence since his move to Barca all went Pete Tong, as his mixed form seems to suggest.

    Apparently Barca are still looking for £70 million. Even if they dropped to £50 million, it’s still too much and risk for me.

    #1825827

    redsforever
    Participant
    • :

    Rob i would love us to re sign coutinho. Sadly i dont see it happening because he’ll be too expensive.

    #1825832

    redsforever
    Participant
    • :

    Even if he costs £70m i think he be worth it.

    #1825839

    pinezes69
    Participant
    • :

    He is a very good player who can help us a lot.
    He pressed to leave even in the middle of the season.
    He is about 27 and 77 mil are a lot.
    I would prefer Werner for 60 mil for various reasons.
    Sancho and Harvetz for about 100 mil each one is a risk…
    Klopp generally prefers players about 25 years old and not more than 50 mil.
    There are exceptions with Virgil and Alisson but we had to do it!!
    These ‘headaches’ are very nice.

    #1825843

    bofa
    Participant
    • :

    He is now too big a risk for that price. As you say Rob, returning players don’t usually deliver to the degree they did before, but even if he does, I don’t think it’s a club policy to pay that kind of money for that age of a player.

    I’m not really bitter that he left as he made a choice that most footballers would at the time. The reality is that we won’t have recouped a fair bit of the cash as many of the targets weren’t met(I believe).

    In addition, he missed 6-8 weeks of most seasons with us due to injury.

    Surely, we’d be better risking buying another young or couple of young players and take a chance on them? The transfer policy has been top class with Klopp so far. Why change it to bring back a player who will be 28 in June?

    #1825852

    gingerlfc
    Participant
    • :

    Coutinho at 27/28 for £75mil or Havertz at 20Yrs old for similar or slightly more money???

    It’s a no brainer for me!

    #1825866
    Razor
    Razor
    Participant
    • :

    Are we really in a position where we need this to happen? The reality is that we sold him and 2 years later we’re the best team in the world. Without him we reached 2 CL finals in a row, almost won the PL last year and are probably going to win it this time around. I don’t understand where people are looking to find this correlation that we’ve been worse off without him or that we would be better with him.

    In that same time, he’s shown that he isn’t as effective when he isn’t the focal point of a team and that his potshots from distance aren’t appreciated at a club that has more emphasis on build up play. We struggled to break teams down often enough when he was here but rarely have that issue without him. From this perspective, what could he possibly add to the entire team ethic and play without taking away massively from other areas of the team? With hindsight, it seems to me that we’ve been far better off without him here.

    #1825972
    j c
    j c
    Participant
    • :

    Let’s just be brutally honest here. He doesn’t have the mental or physical attributes to get in our team these days.

    He’s 28, at the age where it becomes a lot harder to stay at the top and already showing signs of decline.

    Not the same player he was, and not worth the money.

    #1825994
    Red Herring
    Red Herring
    Participant
    • :

    I’d be happy to see him back, but also wouldn’t lose any sleep if he didn’t return as we are better equipped now than when he left. The positives are that we know that he can cut it in the Premier League, whereas sometimes players come from abroad with great reputations and just, for whatever reason, fail. Also, whenever I’ve seen a Bayern game on TV this season and watched for a bit, he’s always looked really good and runs the game for them.

    #1825995
    Red Herring
    Red Herring
    Participant
    • :

    ….or maybe I’ve just been lucky for the snippets where I’ve tuned in.

    #1825997
    Red Herring
    Red Herring
    Participant
    • :

    Razor>> Yes, there’s no denying that we’ve been better off without him, but the debate is whether that is ‘because of’ or ‘in spite of’. The Genius didn’t use to rate him – described him as powder puff – so maybe that is influencing me towards sounding more positive about us getting him back.

    #1826108
    Razor
    Razor
    Participant
    • :

    RH>> I’d say there’s an argument for both as we did buy Alisson and Fabinho with that money and both have been vital cogs in our machine. It’s not that I don’t rate Coutinho. I just don’t see where or how he’s going to fit in with anything; our philosophy, playing style etc. There was an article earlier today where Peter Moore was quoted to have said something to this effect as well.

    #1826113

    pinezes69
    Participant
    • :

    I think that is is difficult Harvetz and Sancho to be sold less than 90 mil. If there is great demand they will be sold 100 mil each one at least.
    If they cost such money then Salah or Mane cost more than 200 mil!!!

    #1826114

    pinezes69
    Participant
    • :

    IMo we need a creative midifielder like Coutinho no more than 60 mil…
    Even Maddison for 80 mil is extravagance.

    #1826170
    AK
    AK
    Participant
    • :

    Hakim Ziyech?
    26
    40m
    better value?

    #1826179

    pinezes69
    Participant
    • :

    Very good choice. He can play mostly as a winger but as a attacking midfielder as well.
    They are options and Lpool has been a very attractive club the last years…

    #1826409
    mwake
    mwake
    Participant
    • :

    Sorry a HARD no. We have moved from Coutinho. I think accidentally we have moved onto a much better system that isn’t compatible with Coutinho.

    There was definitely a time where myself, other fans and the club once believed he could have developed him into an effective “Klopp type player”.

    However, when I think of Coutinho I think of Ozil, he’s in the same league as Ozil, great players when they are in a supportive system but they aren’t players you can depend on in modern high-intensity football. Klopp tried to adapt the team around Coutinho but in the end we gained a better system by sacrificing Coutinho and bringing in VVD.

    Coutinho and Ozil are players who were born at the wrong time, if they played in the 90s or 2000s then their skillsets would be front and centre players but in top-level modern football, their skill sets are less important. For example we all familiar with the sight of Klopp (and Rodgers) pulling Coutinho off in the second half of games. Barca obviously also didn’t have time or space for him and it seems he is struggling at Bayern too. Im not sure what type of ‘top’ team Coutinho would fit in actually, wherever he goes I always get the impression hes going to be a player you start selectively rather than a nailed-on starter. As a substitute option he would be awesome but I don’t see Liverpool (or other teams) paying 70m appx just for random starter and super sub.

    #1826411
    mwake
    mwake
    Participant
    • :

    Strange about Hakim Ziyech, but I think there must have been a good reason why we didnt go for him. Either we got word that he wanted to be in London or the player himself thought he had a better chance of playing at Chelsea, either way Im not too bothered, I trust Klopp and Edwards to have done thir homework, if we really think someone fits our team then we go for them, if not then no. For example look at Fekir, great player, was nailed on to sign but the attitude was a turn off for the club.

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