UEFA Super Cup

This topic contains 80 replies, has 18 voices, and was last updated by  Mikus 4 years, 7 months ago.

Viewing 20 posts - 61 through 80 (of 81 total)
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  • #1774914
    j c
    j c
    Participant
    • :

    I didn’t say you can’t criticise?!

    You on the other hand, the second you faced criticism, you got mad.

    So which one of us thinks criticism is bad?

    Milner should never play midfield again, is what you said. Nobody’s career should be over because you’re upset about the manner in which the game went. That is a really crappy way to support the team. If you don’t like that, so what? It’s just criticism.

    #1774925
    Razor
    Razor
    Participant
    • :

    If he doesn’t play in midfield he can cover LB. What’s wrong with saying he shouldn’t play in midfield again? If I think he’s too slow to play there that’s my opinion. Did I ever say his career is over and he should leave the club? Have I ever once said that we should sell Milner? NO. Please point out to me exactly where I’ve said that. I even went as far as to say during the summer that he’s an option at LB when people were complaining about the lack of cover. Don’t put words into my mouth just because you feel the need to get on your high horse to feel like a man.
    Again I don’t need you to tell me how I should support the club. You started this by calling me a disgrace for criticising a player but now are trying to turn it the other way around and look like a victim. Well you’re not but then again you’re too stupid to see it. It’s what you always do anyway and have been doing for years. So calling someone a disgrace for criticising a player means you’re not of the opinion that criticism is bad? So why did you even feel the need to bring it up in the first place? If you had indeed have no issue with me criticising a player and kept your trap shut I wouldn’t have seen the need to respond to you at all. As it is I think your entire argument is moronic just like you are but it’s just criticism.

    #1774929
    Razor
    Razor
    Participant
    • :

    Sean I think it was always the plan to transition the team in that manner. I remember Rafa doing something similar where he would push the line up 10 yards every season. Theoretically speaking, if the line is that much higher it also means we could start pressing that much higher up the pitch. Naturally our transitions would be that much closer to the opponent’s goal. Furthermore, our FBs would be that much higher up the pitch. It may not seem like much but if an opponent is pinned in that’s less distance to cover for our players during each game which may also help with fitness over the course of the season. For instance, we were on the edge of their box for goal kicks. Gomez and VVD are extremely fast for defenders and you wouldn’t expect them to lose an aerial battle either. That said a high line is always going to be a risk against quick players. Rashford or Vardy for example, would have a field day running into that much space. Conversely, a target man, which is most of the main strikers in the league would have a nightmare as he wouldn’t be able to get up the pitch to get those knock downs and hold the ball up. Most strikers these days are one or the other. However right now I agree with you and think it’s unbalancing the team. Last season the midfielders were sitting back to cover the FBs when they were bombing forward but now they’re further up the pitch as well so those spaces are exposed.

    #1774935

    NotoriousBingo
    Participant
    • :

    Fulcrum… I’ll give you that Gomez was isolated but he has a lot of recovery pace… on the the left flank Ox was so off the pace that our press did not work as wanted…

    The one thing about Alison is his distribution, it’s as good as anyone at the club, we are going to miss that until he comes back and teams will be able to press us and block the channels because of his injury.

    #1774939
    j c
    j c
    Participant
    • :

    By saying Milner should never play his regular role again, and never play again unless it’s to cover at LB, that’s basically you saying his career is over.

    You said it, so own it. You said he should never play again in midfield, his regular position, where he’s played as part of a title challenging team, and become a European champion.

    All I said was I think that’s a disgraceful comment and disgraceful way to show support.
    Your attempt to explain yourself hasn’t changed my mind. You’re just digging your hole deeper as far as I’m concerned.

    #1774945
    Razor
    Razor
    Participant
    • :

    So Milner has never played at LB before for us? How is saying he should be cover at LB ending his career for him? Just explain to me how it’s saying his saying his career his career is over when he will be a Liverpool player and will still get on the pitch as a Liverpool player. I said he shouldn’t play in midfield again and that’s it. I said it, I haven’t denied it like your imagination seems to suggest but I never said his career was over or anything of the sort. That’s something you mentioned yourself just to back up your weak and false statements. Unlike you I’m not digging anything any deeper by trying desperately to cling onto false words and lies. Stop lying to yourself because right now it just looks sad. You’re just trying to find a way out of this without losing face because you can’t find a rational argument. It was weak before and it’s weak now and it will continue to be weak because you have no leg to stand on. As far as I’m concerned you’re just looking stupider and stupider with each passing comment. You were trying to call me out by using the words disgraceful and going as far as to say that I wanted Milner’s career to be over. Now you’re even trying to deny that. Now that you know that your idiotic statements aren’t holding any weight you’re trying to shift the focus away from what you said about me and trying to play the victim. If it hasn’t changed your mind that’s fine with me because I’m already aware of how thick you are. You can’t even explain your own lies properly yet I’m the one supposedly digging the hole for myself. You already know you’ve lost this argument which is why you see the need to twist words and facts to suit your own agenda.

    #1774949
    Razor
    Razor
    Participant
    • :

    You’re a coward and a weak man as far as I’m concerned and I consider people like you to be the lowest of the low. You can’t handle when you’re wrong so you keep going and twisting words and facts until people have had enough of your crap. You can try to hide behind your twisted words and lies but I can already see you for what you really are. In any case I’m just going to ignore you from now on because I don’t feel you’re even on the same intellectual level and I don’t respect you as a person. I already know you’re going to try to respond with the same weak argument from before and try to make it look like my argument has holes in it when you can’t even point them out yourself. You’re really not as smart or wise as you think you are. Just try and prove me wrong by not responding at all because I know people like you just want to have the last word so they can feel like they’ve achieved something in their miserable lives. In any case you can have it. I’m done with you.

    #1774953
    j c
    j c
    Participant
    • :

    I didn’t even read your posts.

    Not worth my time.

    #1774965

    kopite
    Participant
    • :

    Razor: And you are not so better yourself. You resort to calling posters monkeys when posters have a different opinion from others and yet we are suppose to respect your opinion. Bloody hypocrite

    #1774971
    Razor
    Razor
    Participant
    • :

    You can call me a hypocrite all you want but I don’t call posters monkeys just because they disagree with my opinion. I’ve called them monkeys on 2 occasions when they were going on about how FSG and Klopp are conspiring to hide our finances and the like and refuse to make signings because they’re keeping all the money for themselves and when they’re making statements like how Klopp is daft and that our youngsters have absolutely zero chance of breaking into the team this season because they’re too young despite other players doing so at the same age when I simply stated that they might shine if given the chance instead of bringing someone in who more than likely would take a while to settle. I’ve also called people morons for calling me out when I made some comments about Mignolet which were perfectly valid but were dismissed simply because they didn’t read the articles or remember which incidents I was referring to. In other words, if they’re talking out of their arse with baseless comments. If you’re upset about my comments about Milner then explain to me why he should be playing in midfield. Several of us have been saying since pre-season that he’s looked like he’s well off the pace and looks like he’s slower than before. If you’re not going to use context with these things then why bother bringing it up? I for one said absolutely nothing to j c before he saw the need to attack me with nonsensical claims.

    #1774973

    gingerlfc
    Participant
    • :

    Milner played leftback for a season 3yrs ago when asked to by Klopp. By the end of that season it’s reported that he asked Klopp not to play him there any more. That summer we bought Robbo, Moreno and Robbo shared that following season.
    While Milner was pretty solid defensively, he was limited in an attacking sense. We rely on our fullback massively to provide width, speed down the entire wing and quality crosses. Milner frequently had to cut inside onto his right foot to provide the cross which resulted in attacks breaking down.
    We now have a Milner who’s will turn 34 midseason. While he could do fine for cover in a one off game I wouldn’t want to see him there for any prolonged period. I think we’d struggle.
    None of our midfielders covered themselves in glory last night but I don’t think that one game brings any of their midfield careers to a close. That would be a massive knee jerk reaction to a game we ultimately won.

    #1774975
    Razor
    Razor
    Participant
    • :

    You see the difference with ginger’s response now? Has he in any way questioned my loyalty to the club as a fan or resorted to a personal attack? He states why he doesn’t want Milner at LB and why he should still be at midfield. To which I’d respond that I don’t think that it’s a knee jerk reaction as I’ve mentioned previously as it’s been an issue from pre-season. I have no inclination at all to insult him. Same with Bingo previously with regards to Adrian. He even understands that it’s not a matter of ending Milner’s Liverpool career altogether which I have never even once even brought up as an idea as a certain idiot seemed to insinuate but rather giving up his midfield position.

    #1774981

    NotoriousBingo
    Participant
    • :

    Dudes we all write stuff down out of frustration and we hardly ever mean it all… I’m pretty sure Razor would be more than happy to see Milner perform once again…

    If I had commented after the first half it would have been a very bleak and pessimistic post, thankfully Bobby came up with some magic and made that goal for Mane.

    Quite honestly I think the only one that deserves criticism for that performance is Klopp himself. He picked Oxlade to start and demanded the high defensive line. We cant fault the players for following orders.

    Its early days and most of the squad is not match fit, we will get better as we play more games, thankfully our rivals have the same issues.

    #1774989

    liverlad
    Participant
    • :

    My oh My You have brought up this Mignolet post again, you do seem to be an aggressive type & name caller, however I have come to my senses & realise you were correct all the time & I was wrong.
    Sorry about this.

    #1774990

    gingerlfc
    Participant
    • :
    #1774995
    Razor
    Razor
    Participant
    • :

    I only brought it up because I was being called a hypocrite for something I didn’t do. The Mignolet incident was merely an example of an incident where I called some people names. If a passing mention of the Mignolet post was all you picked up on you clearly haven’t been following what’s been going on in this thread and just want to take some sort of moral high ground with me. In which case I suggest you don’t bother because you can’t refute anything I’ve said reasonably with regards to that case yet want to come on here and act high and mighty. I don’t call people names just because they disagree with me. I do it when 1. they call me out without doing any fact checking and make false statements or 2. they’re talking absolute nonsense or 3. they’re being hostile. In the Mignolet case it was clear whoever had called me out didn’t even bother to read the article yet wanted to run his mouth. In that case it’s obvious that whoever did that just wanted to make it personal. Beyond what I mentioned, there were no other incidents of said name calling. There isn’t a single incident where I’ve insulted someone simply because their opinion has differed from mine. If you can give a proper counter argument to the stuff I say then by all means say it. But if you can’t and still want to call me out on stuff, don’t expect me to take it lying down. I’ve never even said I was correct all the time but if you’re wrong about certain things simply because you didn’t check your facts that’s on you. The same applies to me if I haven’t checked my facts and started running my mouth.

    #1775074

    Sean the sailor
    Participant
    • :

    Interesting from vvd ginger and also some valid points from razor about why we are playing so high

    The problem is your need to really pressure and press the opposition when playing this way. At times we stood off Chelsea and that’s because we were tired which is understandable

    Just don’t why we are changing a winning formula. It’s like padraig Harrington changing his swing after 3 major victories and he was never the sane golfer

    I’m sick Jurgen knows what he’s doing but we very rarely conceded many chances last season now teams are getting much more openings

    Let’s see if we are back keeping clean sheets soon. I’d much rather we played like last season then the year before. Let’s season we could attack and defend. We were absolutely rock solid. You felt very comfortable defending leads and seeing games out

    #1775076
    steveosnakeeye
    steveosnakeeye
    Participant
    • :

    if its not broke why fix it? could be costly error from Klopp …

    #1775096

    gingerlfc
    Participant
    • :

    Don’t quite understand the change myself because if you compress more players into a smaller space then that leave some less space to operate in, create chances and score goals. For those teams that sit back and want to defend surely less space suits them. Also leaves us open to balls over the top onto a willing fast runner.
    VAR may have something to do with it. At the min I’m not liking it.
    Norwich had more shots than any other team last year. We were renowned last year for giving teams very little chance to shoot.

    #1775112
    Razor
    Razor
    Participant
    • :

    The thing is Sean, whoever you are you can’t sit on your laurels after a good season. Even champions have to improve in some way or another if they want to remain champions or if they want to open a bigger gap between them and their rivals. Since we haven’t felt that signings would improve us the improvements can be made tactically or with individual player improvements. Most teams have already played us twice last season which means the way we play would have already been analysed twice at least. For the top managers twice is more than enough to take advantage of your weaknesses if you’re going to set up the same way again. Some don’t even need to play you to know how to take you. This is exactly where Rodgers failed. He had no idea how to change it up. He just went with whatever worked and didn’t try to change anything even with different players. He didn’t know how to use his players strengths and weaknesses to build a new system when we no longer had the same players for the one that worked. I think this is more to do with adding some versatility to our game so we’re not as predictable. I can only speculate but I’m sure Klopp has spent the entire summer drawing up these plans with certain players in mind, like Alisson or VVD. It also doesn’t help that our key players barely even had a pre season so he couldn’t try out these things then and get them up to speed in this system.

    I don’t like it either. I’ve never been a fan of the high line especially in the PL. The game is too fast. If you’re playing that kind of line you’d need to be excellent at winning the ball back (which we are) and dominating the tempo of the game by controlling the ball (which we’re decent at but not fantastic) and controlling the spaces (which we haven’t done so well thus far). The great Barca team didn’t need exceptional ball winners because of the Spanish game but they still had the players to turn over possession when they needed to. Concurrently they had someone who could single handedly control the game in Xavi. The entire team moved around him. We have Firmino who is excellent at being that pivot but he’s playing in a really advanced position. My opinion is that we’d need someone like this in midfield who can dictate the tempo for this to work. Easier said than done tbh. Where can we possibly find a midfield metronome like Xavi who also has the physicality to play in our system? No one comes to mind.

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