Whats wrong with our youth ?

This topic contains 18 replies, has 10 voices, and was last updated by  jm1502 6 years, 4 months ago.

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  • #1137678

    pogba6
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    Many times we have lauded our youth players as the next big thing but many times we are left disappointed. The common trend is that the player delivers world class performances for a short period & then suddenly blows off. Are managerial changes over the last 4 seasons to blame or the players lack the desire to fight their way back to the top when they start underperforming or fans harm these youth players by throwing so much hype their way too early in their careers. Januzaj, Wilson, Keane, Mcnair & Blackett all enjoyed very promising spells in the first team but something happened & suddenly their development seems to have stopped. I hope Rashford, TFM & CBJ don’t go down the same road as the players i have mentioned. Something is wrong in our system & it must be solved quickly if we are going to have sustained success of the academy in the future.

    #1137813

    jm1502
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    It’s simple mate. Most of them just aren’t very good. Take Januzaj for example, looked good in a poor team for a while before he was found out. Then everyone, including Dortmund, realised he’s average. Fact is, our scouts have been piss poor in terms of recognizing both junior and senior talent for years, not least Fergie’s fat brother. I could do a better job!!

    #1137855
    Alfie07
    Alfie07
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    The quality of player we require now is so high that it becomes increasingly unlikely that our academy will be able to produce players good enough to hold down a first team place.

    Quite ironic spending £100m on a player that was once in your academy, but when you have that sort of money around and can buy the best players around it does seem unlikely to have better in the youth teams.

    No reason why we can’t churn out squad players though.

    #1137909

    pogba6
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    • :

    @alfie07 I think us lacking a spine of 6-7 quality players is also a factor mate. Young players are supposed to be tutored or mentored into the team by quality experienced leaders who have established themselves in the team. At the moment even our captain’s abilities are in doubt, Carrick’s leadership qualities do not fill me with any confidence. So basically we lack that Lahm, Gabi or Iniesta type of player who the players can look up to with respect. The first thing we need is to build a very strong core of the team that can play together for the next five years then slowly gel in academy players. Any 18-21 year old player feels less pressure & has more confidence when playing alongside proven quality players(Vidic type of players) than when you play alongside the likes of Smalling & Jones(Players who can easily panic). Look at the development of Stones, we cannot overlook Jagielka’s role. We seriously lack leaders who can guide & tutor such young talent.

    #1138311
    killyboye
    killyboye
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    There is also the adrenaline factor, for their first few games players are buzzing, playing for Utd in OT is a dream come true and they are pumped and exhilarated which possibly carries them up a level. After a few games this may wear off so the mediocre players return to form, Blackett, and the truly gifted players keep their place, Rashford.
    Also, even with a strong academy only a few will make it, Class of 92 was a golden generation, Barca had it with Puyol, Xavi, Iniesta and Messi. It’s rare to have squads like that, very much the exception not the rule in top level football.

    #1138341

    Ackb050
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    Janusaj maybe leaving, great talent sti young I hope we can take a leaf out of Barcelona and real Madrid and insert buyback clause.

    #1138539

    Very few big clubs churn out youngsters at a regular rate who form part of their first team, or even squad players – most are sold on to make small profits so that they can get in bigger players; Barcelona and Bayern Munich are the only exceptions to this rule as they do have high quality youth systems, however the likes of Real Madrid, Juventus, all English clubs, have one, maybe two regulars in their starting XI coming from the youth team. At United we have Lingard, Januzaj, Rashford, Fosu-Mensah, McNair, Borthwick Jackson, Periera and Wilson who have been in and out of the first team over the last few years, which isn’t bad at all.

    People keep expecting to have a Class of 92 coming through coz that’s what we’re used to, but the truth is that no club in history has ever brought in so many youngsters into the first team and managed to succeed over a long period of time (not even Barca’s youth promotion of the likes of Xavi and Iniesta had so many youth team players). The promotion of youth at United is fine.

    #1138821

    jm1502
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    Not sure we’re used to a class of 92 are we? Apart from 92 of course.

    #1139301

    pogba6
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    The class of 92 was a dream, it will never be repeated. Nothing more appealing than seeing a academy filled team lift trophies driven by their love & pride for the club. Seems like the galactico way is our way now.

    #1139472

    @jm1502 – What I meant was that, for United fans growing up in the Class of 92 era, we were used to world class players coming through the ranks and leading us to glory because that was the first group we saw get promoted, and even for the next decade when we barely had any graduates, we still talked and discussed United’s excellent youth policy as we were still profiting from the likes of Scholes, Giggs and Neville still being in and around the first team. In reality though, the normal standard should be what we’ve seen from 1999 onwards – one-off players coming in and around the first team, like Brown, O’Shea, Fletcher were and how Lingard, Rashford, Fosu-Mensah are now.

    #1139580
    hatters
    hatters
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    The class of ’92 was the last time our academy created worldclass talent. We have never created worldclass players since then and that’s a fact. Our famed youth system is a myth.

    Januzaj will never become a worldclass player, there I said it.

    Lately we have seen some better youth products but it remains to be seen if they can actually make it as worldclass players. Funnily enough, our best youth product in recent years is Pogba and we are about to shatter the world transfer record to buy him back. Fosu Mensah (LvG buy) and Rashford could also become great players but they still have a long way to go.

    #1139874

    happyhurling
    Participant
    • :

    The problem is we’re looking for World Class players of which there are only a handful. People who question our youth completely overlook the amount of players who have forged a very good career for themselves in the premier league. There are loads! In the current first team set up we have Johnstone, TFM, Borthwell-Jackson, Riley, McNair, Blackett, Pereira, Januzaj, Keane, Wilson and Rashford off the top of my head. We produce a hell of a lot of youth talent, a lot of whom are able to become very good Premier League players like Shawcross for example. So I don’t think there’s anything particularly wrong with our youth. Granted there aren’t amazing world class talents coming out every year but are Chelsea, City, Arsenal or Liverpool producing world class talents?

    #1139889

    jm1502
    Participant
    • :

    From the class of 92 I’d rate Giggs, Scholes and Beckham as world class. since then, nothing. Happy’s right of course in that we’ve produced quite a few youngsters who’ve gone on to be decent PL and Championship players. Point is though, if you don’t regularly produce youngsters who are good enough to come through, and history tells us we don’t, you have to buy them, either proven at the highest level or youngsters from clubs who do produce top young talent.

    #1139901
    hatters
    hatters
    Participant
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    @happy. You make a great point about our academy consistently producing EPL quality players. There are many decent players out there from the United academy and it’s something the club should be proud of.

    #1139973

    jm1502
    Participant
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    Decent players? Proud? The biggest club in the country, arguably the world? Behave!

    #1142517
    CR
    CR
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    Hm…obviously the Class of 92 was a one off which we can’t expect to replicate every year. But I’d argue that we’ve had very good players coming through since then. Was Brown and Darren Fletcher come to mind. I’m convinced that if Fletcher and Hargreaves would have been fit we would have won at least another CL. At their peak they were easily the best defensive midfielders and hard-working in Europe.

    And now with the bunch of youngsters coming through, some of them home-grown and some of them bought, we have a crop of youngsters whose potential is nothing short of amazing. I wouldn’t swap the likes of Rashford, Martial, TFM, Shaw as well as others for any other players in the world right now. Plus of course, we could still get back Pogba.

    #1142529
    hatters
    hatters
    Participant
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    @jm1502. Mate what I am referring to is the likes of players like Fletcher, O’Shea, Brown, Cleverly, Welbeck, Simpson, Drinkwater, and the like. If the club produces players like this it means we can sell them off and make a bit of money or we can supplement the squad with some Premier League level players.

    It’s a fact that the Manchester United academy has the most players currently playing in the Championship and Premier League. That’s something to be proud of in this day and age; although obviously we would like to produce some worldclass players who can stay, at least we are creating careers for young English players – moreso than any other English club.

    @cr. Hargreaves was a product of the Bayern Munich academy.

    #1142655
    MacGuffin
    MacGuffin
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    • :

    United homegrown talent is largely a myth born from the Babes. Since the Babes what world class talent have we created fromn youth. Best and the class of 92. Other than that nobody. We have produced a steady stream of decent players of the level already mentioned.

    The Fletcher types are of value in giving us competent second stringers. The sale of youngsters does bring in revenue. I’d like to see the acadamy operate as profit center. Let the first team “buy” players from the acadamy.

    The argument that great players are so rare the club cannot be expected to regularly produce them is flawed. Yes 92 is an exception because all the players were local lads, even Becks was English. That we cannot expect.

    BUT the club scours the world for top youngsters and even pays tidy sums to sign them. United has a worldwide name that attracts youngsters. Think of it like a univeristy. Oxford Cambridge attract the brightest students from around the world and DO regularly produce great minds and prize winners. And they dont pay students to come to them. Is it unreasonable to expect United to be similarly successful,

    The difference is in the numbers. How many players are in United’s youth. How many at Barca or Bayern. And when they get older what arrangements are made for their progress. If a player at United is not in the first team how does he develop. Had Pogba been loaned to a PL team would he still be here. Had other players been loaned would they have improved or at least been released sooner.

    In my view the youth system is flawed and failing. That United players sent their sons to City acadamy speaks volumes.

    United should be the Oxbridge of football schools. It should do like Eton and open schools abroad. Let their be a United acadamy in Brazil Nigeria wherever and the brightest prospects developed. Ex players can manage the schools. If United had thousands of youth then we could have the top talent.

    AND ……. related point I wont develop. We are (were) good at buying players and improving them. That the likes of Zaha or Powell dont work out is the price to pay for the Ronaldos. The art is to move them on sooner if they dont look like making the grade.

    PS – sorry for long posts but want to cover all the bases.

    #1142808

    jm1502
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    • :

    Spot on MacGuffin!

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